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Chip Childers, Cloud Foundry Foundation | Cloud Foundry Summit 2017


>>Narrator: Live, from
Santa Clara in the heart of Silicon Valley, it’s theCUBE. Covering Cloud Foundry Summit 2017. Brought to you by the Cloud
Foundry Foundation and Pivotal.>>Hi this is Stu Miniman, joined with my cohost, John Troyer. Happy to welcome to the
program a first-time guest, Chip Childers, who’s the CTO of the Cloud Foundry Foundation. Chip, fresh off the keynote stage,
>>Yep.>>how’s everything going?>>It’s going great. We’re really happy with the
turnout of the conference. We are really happy with the number of large enterprises that are
here to share their story. The really active vendor
ecosystem around the project. It’s great. It’s a wonderful event so far.
>>Yeah, I was looking back, I think the last time I came
to the Cloud Foundry Show, it was before the Foundation existed, We were in the Hilton in San Francisco, it was
obviously a way smaller group. Tell us kind of the
goals of the Foundation, doing the event, bringing
the community in.>>Yeah, you can think about
our goals as being of course, we’re the stewards of the
intellectual property, the actual software that
the vendors distribute. We see our role in the ecosystem as being really two key things. One: we’re focused on
supporting the users, the customers, and the direct uses of the Open Source software. That’s first and foremost. Second though, we want to make sure there is a really robust market ecosystem that is wrapped around this project, right. Both in terms of the distribution, the regional providers that offer Cloud Foundry based services, but also large system
integrators that are helping those customers go through
digital transformation. Re-platform applications,
you know really figure out their way through this process. So, it’s all about supporting the users and then supporting the market around it.>>Yeah, as we go to
a lot of these events, you know, there are
certain themes that emerge. There were two big ones
that both of them showed up in what you did in the Keynote. Number one is Multicloud, number two is you got all of these various open sourced pieces,
>>Chip: Yep. you know, what fits together,
what interlocks together, you know which ones sit side by side. Why don’t we start with kind of the open source piece first? Because you’re heavily
involved in a lot of those. Cloud Foundry, you know,
what are the new pieces that are bolting on, or sitting on top, or digging into it, and
what’s going on there?>>You know, I think
first I want to start with a basic philosophy of
our upstream community. There are billions of dollars that rely on this platform today. And that continues to grow. Right, because we’re
showing up in Fortune 500, Global 2000, as well as
lots of small start-ups, that are using Cloud Foundry
to get code shipped faster. So our community that builds
the UpStream software, spends a lot of time being very thoughtful about their technical decisions. So what we release and
that what gets productized by the down streams is a complete system. From operating system all the way up to including the various
programming languages and frameworks and everything in between. And because we release
a complete platform, at a really high velocity, so many people rely on it’s quality, we’re very thoughtful about
when is the right time to build our own, when should we adopt
and embrace and continue to support another OpenSource project, so we spend a lot of time
really thinking about that. And the areas today that I highlight around specific collaborations include the Open Service Broker
API which we actually spun out of being just a Club
Foundry implementation. And we embrace other communities, and found a way to share
the governance of that. So we move forward as a
big industry together.>>Stu: Yeah and speaking
on that a little bit more. Very interesting to see. I saw Red Hat for instance speaking with Open Shift,
Kubernetes is there. So, how should customers think about this? Are the path wars over? Now you can choose all
the pieces that you want? Or, it’s probably oversimplifying it.>>I think it’s over
simplifying it, it depends. You can go try to build your
own platform if you want, through a number of serious components, or you can just use
something like Cloud Foundry, that has solve for that. But the important thing is that we have specifically designed
Cloud Foundry to allow for the backing services
to come from anywhere. And so, it’s both a differentiator for the various distributions
of Cloud Foundry, but also an opportunity
for Cloud providers, and even more importantly, it’s an opportunity for
the enterprise users that live in complex worlds, right? They’re going to have multiple platforms, they’re going be multiple
levels of abstraction from Bms to containers, you know, to the path abstraction even
event driven frameworks. We want that all to work
really well together. Regardless of the choices you make, because that’s what’s most
valuable to the customers.>>Okay, the other piece,
networking you talked about. Why don’t you share.
>>Yeah, yeah so, besides the Service Broker
API, we’ve added support for what’s called Container
to Container Networking. I don’t necessarily need to
dig into the details there, but let’s just say that when
you’re building microservices that the application that the user is experiencing is actually a combination of a lot of different applications. That all talk to each other
and rely on each other. So we want to make sure there’s
a policy-based framework for describing how the
webs here is going to talk to the authentication
service or is going to talk to the booking service,
or the inventory service. They all need to have rules about how they communicate with each other. And we want to do that in the
most efficient way possible. So we’ve adopted the Containing
Networking interface as the standard plugin that is now at CNCF, the Cloud Native Computing Foundation. We think it’s the right
abstraction, we think it’s great. It gives us access to all
the fascinating work that is going on around software networking, overlay networking, industry standard API plugin
to our policy-driven framework.>>Along the same theme, Kubo, a big new news project
also kind of integration of some Cloud Foundry concepts
with a broader ecosystem, in this case another
CNCF project, Kubernetes. Could you speak a little bit to that?>>The Kubernetes community
is doing a great job creating great container
driven experience. You know that abstraction
is all about the container. It’s not about, you know, the code. So it’s different than Cloud Foundry. There are workloads that make sense to run in one or the other. And we want to make sure
that they run really well. Right, so the problem that we’re solving with the Kuber project is
what deploys Kubernetes? What supports Kubernetes if there is an infrastructure adage
and a node goes offline? Right, because it does a great
job of restarting containers, but if you have ten nodes in a cluster, and then now you’re down
to nine, that’s a problem. So what Bosh does, is it takes care of solving the node outage level problem. You can also do rolling
upgrades that are seamless, no downtime for the Kubernetes cluster. It brings a level of operational maturity to the Kubernetes users that they may not have had otherwise.>>Chip, can you bring us
inside a little bit the creation of Kubo, is that something that the market and customers
drove towards you? I talked to a couple other
Cloud Foundry ecosystem members that were doing some other ways of integrating in Kubernetes. So what lead to this way
of deploying it with Bosh?>>Yeah, absolutely so, it came out of a direct collaboration
between Pivotal and Google. And it was driven based on
Pivotal customer demand. It also, if you speak
with people from Google that are involved in the project, they also see it as a need,
for the Kubernetes ecosystem. So it’s driven based on real-world large financial services companies that wanted to have the
multiple abstractions available, they wanted to do it with a common operational platform
that is proven mature that they’ve already adopted. And then as that collaboration board, the fruit of the project, and it was announced by Pivotal and Google several months back, they realized that they needed to move it to the vendor neutral locations so that we can continue
to expand the community that can work on it, that
can build up the story.>>The other topic I
raised at the beginning of the interview, was the Multicloud. So in a panel, Microsoft, Google, MTC for Amazon was there. All of the Cloud guys
are going to tell you we have the best platform and can do the best things for you.
>>Of course they do.>>How do you balance the “We want to live in a multicultural
Cloud world” and be able to go there versus “Oh I’m going to take standard plus and get
in a little bit deeper to make sure that we’re stickier
with the customers there.” What role does Cloud Foundry play? What have you seen in
the marketplace for that?>>Well the public lab providers are, if you look at the
services that they offer, you can roughly categorize
them with two things. One, are the infrastructure
building blocks. Two, are the higher level services, like their database capabilities, their analytics capabilities, log aggregation, you know, and they all have
a portfolio that varies, some have specific things
that are very similar. So when we talk about MultiCloud
we talk about Cloud Foundry as a way to make use of
those common capabilities, now they’re going to differentiate based on speeds and feeds, availability, whatever they choose to, but you can then as a user have choice. And then secondarily, that
Open Service Broker initiative is what’s really about saying
“great, there’s also all these really valuable
additional capabilities, that, as a user, I may choose to integrate
with a Google machine learning-service, or I
may choose to integrate with a wonderful Microsoft capability, or an Amazon capability.” And we just want to make that easy for a developer to make that choice.>>Chip, Cloud Founder
was very early in terms of a concept of a platform of services, let’s not call it platform
as a service right now. But you know, this platform that going to make developers lives easier, multi-target, MultiCloud we call it now, on from your laptop to anywhere. And it’s been a really
interesting discussion over the last couple years as this
parallel container thread can come up with Kubernetes and Mesosphere and all the orchestration tools, and the focus has been
on orchestration tools. And I’ve always thought
Cloud Foundry was kind of way ahead of the game
in saying “wait a minute, there’s a set of services
that you’re going to have for full life-cycles,
day two operation, at scale that you all are going to have to pull together from components.” As we’re doing this interview here, and this year at Cloud Foundry
Summit are there anything that you think people
don’t kind of realize that over and over again people who are using Cloud Foundry
go, “Wow I’m really glad “I had logging or identity management,” or what are some of the frameworks that people sometimes don’t realize is in there that actually
is a huge time-savor.>>Yeah, there are a lot
of operational capabilities in the Cloud Foundry platform. When you include both our
Bosh layer, as well as the elastic runtime which is in the developer centers experience–>>John: Anything that people don’t often realize is in there?>>Well, I think that the
right way to think of it is, it’s all the things you need
in one application, right? So we’ve been doing this
for years as developers. In the applications operators
team, we’ve been doing it. We’ve just been doing
it via bunch of tickets, we’ve been doing it via bunch of scripts. What Cloud Foundry does is it takes all of those capabilities
you need to really trust a platform to operate
something on your behalf, and give you the right
view into it, right? The appropriate telemetry,
log aggregation, and know that there’s going
to be help monitoring there. It makes it really easy. Right, so we were talking
earlier about the haiku, that Onsi Fakhouri from
Pivotal had authored, it’s appropriate. It’s a promise that a platform makes. And platforms designed to let a user trust that the declarative
nature of asking a platform to do X, Y, or Z, will be delivered.>>Chip, we’ve been hearing
Pivotal talks a lot about Spring, when Cloud Foundry’s involved. Is it so much so that the Foundation needs to be behind that, or support that? How does that interact and work?>>Well, we’re super
supportive of all the languages in the framework communities
that are out there. You know, even if you
pick a particular vendor, Pivotal in this case has
a very strong investment in the Spring, Spring Cloud, Spring Boot, they’re doing really amazing things. But that’s also, it’s
our software, you know, they steward that community, so all the other vendors actually
get the advantage of that. Let’s take Dot Net and Microsoft. Microsoft open sourced Dot Net. So now you can run Dot
Net applications on Linux. They’re embrace of the
container details and the APIs and their operating system is making it so that now it can also run on Windows. So the whole Microsoft technology stack, languages and frameworks, they matter quite a bit
to the enterprise as well. So we see ourselves as supportive of all of these communities, right? Even ones like the Ruby community. When there’s an enterprise developer that chooses to use something like Ruby, with the Ruby on Rails framework, if they use Cloud Foundry,
they’re getting the latest and greatest version of that language, framework, they know that it’s secure, they know that it’s going
to be patched for them. So it’s actually a great
experience for that developer, that’s working with the language. So, we like to support all of them, we’re big fans of any
that work really well with the platform and
maybe integrate deeper. But it’s a polyglot platform.>>We want to give you the final word. People take away from
Cloud Foundry Summit 2017, what would you want them to take away?>>Yeah the simple takeaway
that I can give you is that this is an absolutely enterprise grade open source ecosystem. And you don’t hear that often, right? Because normally we talk about products, being enterprise great.>>Did somebody say in the
keynote enterprise great mean that there’s a huge salesforce that’s going to try sell you stuff?
(Chip laughs) Well that’s coming from the buying side of the market for years. And you know, it was a bit of a joke. What is “enterprise great?” Well, it means that there’s
a piece of paper that says, this product will cost x dollars and the salesperson is offering it to you. So of course it’s going
to be enterprise great. But really, we see it as
four key things, right? It’s about security, it’s
about being well-integrated, it’s about being able
to scale to the needs of even the largest enterprises, and it’s also about that
great developer experience. So, Cloud Foundry is an ecosystem and all of our downstream
distributions get the advantage of this really robust and mature technical community that
is producing this software.>>Chip, really appreciate
you sharing all the updates with us, and appreciate
the foundation’s support to bring theCUBE here. We’ll be back with lots
more coverage here from The Cloud Foundry Summit
2017, you’re watching theCUBE. (techno music)

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